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Monday, December 19, 2011

Cause & Effect Lessons for Alabama


by Chuck McGlawn 12/19/2011
The Cause & Effect lessons and REAL LIFE experience has shifted Alabama’s stance on its extremist immigration law from defiance to damage control.[Did he say DAMAGE CONTROL? That would mean the law is doing DAMAGE.] Gov. Robert Bentley admitted this month that the law needed fixing…   

We now learn that, “When Mr. Bentley signed the law in June, he ignored warnings from legal experts and civil-rights advocates that it would curtail rights for all Alabamians, criminalize routine business transactions and acts of charity, encourage racial profiling, and cast an unconstitutional chill on school enrollment.”

Warnings came from other sources as well. It turn out that, “The governor and legislators were also warned that the law would attract multiple lawsuits and pummel the economy, particularly farming when immigrant workers fled.” It raises a question what percentage of Alabama’s population would have to be among the 74% of …Americans [who] Think (Wrongly) That Illegal Immigrants Hurt the Economy, for the Governor to ignore all the informed warnings.

Any Governor, worth his salt knows what to do when, “The warnings have all come true” according to a New York Times Editorial, Alabama’s Second Thoughts Published: December 17, 2011

The law, as written and passed enables utility providers, “In just one example, some utilities are threatening to shut off customers without the right papers.”

From the NY Times editorial, “Mr. Strange [has] spent six months trying to defend the law in court and in public. At one point he even challenged the federal government’s authority to investigate civil-rights abuses committed under the law. A federal appeals court has temporarily blocked parts of the law; most recently, a judge issued a restraining order preventing Alabama from denying trailer-home licenses to people it decides are here illegally.”

Attorney general, Luther Strange has seen the light, as he, “is urging lawmakers to drop some major provisions, including:

“The requirement that schools collect immigration data on children and parents, which he said would cost too much for the benefit it would provide.

“The part making it a crime for immigrants not to carry their papers, which is illegal under federal law.

“The part barring people from college if they do not have documents, because some people, like certain refugees, can be here legally without documents.

“The sections that allow Alabama residents to sue officials they believe are not adequately enforcing the law, because of conflicts with the state Constitution.

Even if lawmakers accept Mr. Strange’s proposals, it still will not undo the harm — to the undocumented, to all Alabamians, to the state’s image and economy. This law is indefensible. The only solution is repeal.
Unfortunately, too many of Alabama’s politicians still don’t get it. Mike Hubbard, the House speaker, vowed on Facebook, “we’re not going to repeal or weaken the law, acquiescing to liberal elites’ and the news media’s efforts to intimidate and shame Alabama.” And 12 senators have written to the governor, urging him not to retreat. news media’s efforts to intimidate and shame Alabama.” And 12 senators have written to the governor, urging him not to retreat.

23 comments:

Anonymous said...

Don't be an idiot, Mr. McGlawn.

The strong arm of the Federal government has threatened to withdraw federal funding from Alabama for failing to toe the line and allow indigent illegal foreigners to steal jobs, ransack the public treasure for free healthcare, education, welfare and other various social services and perpetrate crimes on their state citizens.

The hypocrisy, of course, is that dozens of official sanctuary cities in America have been openly and defiantly violating Federal immigration statutes and the Federal government does NOTHING to punish their behavior.

Normally good Libertarians would decry and condemn such hypocritical behavior and demand that the Federal government stop encroaching on state rights.

Funny how people are willing to compromise their purported inherent beliefs to further their social agendas.

And that is precisely why the nation swirls the porcelain bowl.

Chuckest said...

How much real damage would A4’s anti-liberty, anti-free market position have to cause before he would admit that liberty and free markets produce prosperity?

Would the fact that the title of the article is “Alabama’ Second Thoughts” not, “Feds Strong-Arm Alabama Into, Destructive Immigration Policy” have any effect on Kool-Aid drinker A4?

The article reveals that, “When Mr. Bentley signed the law in June, he ignored warnings from LEGAL EXPERTS AND CIVIL RIGHTS ADVOCATES…” He ignored the warnings, “…that it would curtail RIGHTS OF ALL ALABAMIANS…” Bentley was pandering to the know nothing 74% of his voters that wrongly think illegal immigration harms the economy when he ignored the warning that it would, “…criminalize routine business transactions and acts of charity, encourage racial profiling…? Bentley was willing to ignore the warning that the law would, “…cast an unconstitutional chill on school enrollment.” The article pointed out that, “The governor and legislators were also warned that the law would attract multiple lawsuits and pummel the economy, particularly farming when immigrant workers fled.”

The FULL ARTICLE is available at http://tinyurl.com/NYTimesSecondthoughts. I hesitate to suggest that A4 read it. I would not want to confuse him with the facts, since his mind is already made up.

A4 said “The strong arm of the Federal government has threatened to withdraw federal funding…” an assertion that A4 pulled from a place where the sun doesn’t shine.

A4 said, “Normally good Libertarians would decry and condemn such hypocritical behavior and demand that the Federal government stop encroaching on state rights.” Which I did in Nine States & The Liberty ViewsLetter Backs Arizona on Immigration and also in the original blog post about Alabama called, Cause and Effect Can Solve the Immigration Problem By Chuck McGlawn 12/02/2011 where I opened the article with, “The US and especially Alabama is about to get a real-life lesson on “Cause and Effect”. That is if the courts stay out of Alabama’s H.B. 56, passed on June 9, 2011.”

I will close with; what part of “Damage Control” do you not understand, and any swirling in the porcelain bowl will be exacerbated by baseless bleating of brainless A4s that populate the know nothing 74%. Please do not add another number to their misinformed ranks.

Anonymous said...

Mr. McGlawn said:

"A4 said “The strong arm of the Federal government has threatened to withdraw federal funding…” an assertion that A4 pulled from a place where the sun doesn’t shine"

You owe me an apology. Here is a letter from the DOJ to a local sheriff in Alabama threatening to pull funding under the guise that it is discriminatory to target illegal foreigners with a brown skin color. They will create any excuse to ensure the States cannot protect their citizens by enforcing basic laws (criminal and labor) against illegal invaders. And once again, Mr. McGlawn applauds Federal intervention into State matters - yet out of the other side of his mouth call himself a lover of liberty. The hypocrisy is truly laughable.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/74959455/DOJ-Letter-To-Alabama-Law-Enforcement-Agencies

But you will note that Mr. McGlawn will not respond to my comments that illuminate the fact that the Feds refuse to sue or take away Federal funding from sanctuary cities that openly and defiantly VIOLATE Federal immigration statues by giving illegal invaders safe harbor at the expense of the taxpaying public. Mr. McGlawn won't defend the innocent citizen taxpayer. He will defend the illegal invader and support the tyrannical Federal government that gives the illegal invader open access to our society.

You speak out of both sides of your mouth, Mr. McGlawn. With one side constantly contradicting the other.

As soon as you start sharing your home with illegal invaders rent-free, financing their medical care, feeding them and educating them at personal expense - I will have a semblance of respect for your views. Until that time I will consider you an egregious hypocrite.

Chuckest said...

I owe you nothing, Your attempt to blame the DOJ for causing the State Government’s about face on HB 56 is a perfect example of your willing to try to lie your way out of a sound challenge.

There are three problems with your citation. First, the letter you cite was to a County Sheriff, who has little or no influence on the Governor to conduct Damage Control. If the DOJ were trying to effect the State the Letter would have gone to the Governor, or at least to the State's Attorney General.

Secondly the letter was written on Dec 3, 2011. The warning of DAMAGE to Alabama like, “…curtail RIGHTS OF ALL ALABAMIANS…" “…criminalize routine business transactions and acts of charity, encourage racial profiling…?” “…cast an unconstitutional chill on school enrollment.” was a warning from LEGAL EXPERTS AND CIVIL RIGHTS ADVOCATES that predated the June signing of HB56.

Thirdly, you want the Feds to follow the law when dealing with, “…dozens of official sanctuary cities in America have been openly and defiantly violating Federal immigration statutes and the Federal government does NOTHING to punish their behavior.” But when a County Sheriff violates Federal law, you want to say it is the only cause for the “Second Thoughts” the Governor is proposing.

Forget about the DOJ, deal with the DAMAGE that is being done to all Alabama citizens. Deal with the fact that a letter from the state’s attorney general, Luther Strange, to legislative leaders suggesting that they throw out whole sections of the law to make it easier to defend in court.

Mr. Strange’s letter came after, as predicted, he spent six months trying to defend the law in court and in public. Deal with the revelation that all of the dire predictions, “…have all come true.”

Most importantly, deal with the consistency of the Liberty Views that has called for the Feds, the Courts to take a “HANDS OFF” position on Arizona and Alabama.

It would cause much suffering for the people of Arizona and Alabama. However, it would give everyone (even A4)a realization that immigration should be more open. The benefits would be immeasurable.

BTW "even A4" being changed is not likely. Anti-illegal immigration is his new religion.

Anonymous said...

Mr. McGlawn said:

"If the DOJ were trying to effect the State the Letter would have gone to the Governor, or at least to the State's Attorney General"

The DOJ has already filed a lawsuit against the State of Alabama for attempting to protect their citizens from the onslaught of illegal invaders who have stolen their jobs, perpetrated crimes on citizens, and usurped hundreds of millions of citzen taxpayer dollars. Now the DOJ was directly threatening the local police agencies with withholding routine federal subsidies for their operations if they enforced the laws against the illegal invaders. And liberty lover apologists like you applaud their tyrannical efforts!

Has there EVER been a DOJ lawsuit or a threat of withdrawing Federal subsidies from sanctuary cities that have been eregiously and blatantly violating Federal immigration laws and providing safe harbor to illegal invaders over the last 2 decades??? Of course not, Mr. McGlawn. But you conveniently overlook that clear hypocrisy, don't you???

You seem to favor Federal government tyranny when it suits your purpose and condemn it when it doesn't. The hypocrisy is crystal clear. You make it all too easy for your opponent to shine the light of truth on your contradictory viewpoints. I suggest you pick a side and stick with it!!!

We have already seen what open border immigration has done to Santa Ana and Los Angeles. Those are two REAL LIFE shining examples of what illegal immgration does to America. Both have turned into disaster areas in the last 2 decades. You'd have to be a babbling buffoon not to see it.

As I said before, Mr. McGlawn:

As soon as you start sharing your home with illegal invaders rent-free, financing their medical care, feeding them and educating them at personal expense - I will have a semblance of respect for your views. Until that time I will consider you an egregious hypocrite.

Chuckest said...

Then you need to cite the DOJ Lawsuit not some unrelated letter to a County Sheriff.

When you make your case, I will admit I have been wrong. Will you make the same pledge?

Chuckest said...

BTW, be sure to include the date od the DOJ Filing

Anonymous said...

Mr. McGlawn said:

"Then you need to cite the DOJ Lawsuit not some unrelated letter to a County Sheriff"

Come on, Mr. McGlawn. Stop playing stupid. Why would it surprise you that the DOJ would sue Alabama over immigration policy when they just got through doing the same thing to Arizona. Here, straight from the horse's mouth:

http://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/2011/August/11-ag-993.html

Now, as I clearly stated before - the DOJ has failed to sue or withdraw Federal subsidies from even one of the dozens of sanctuary cities spread across the US - and those cities have BLATANTLY defied US Immigration Law and openly provided safe harbor to illegal invaders for over 2 decades!!! But you apologists go right along with the BLATANT hypocrisy and promote Federal tyranny while you call yourselves lovers of liberty!!! HOGWASH!!!

Just recently the city of New Haven, CT has proposed allowing ILLEGAL FOREIGNERS to vote for city candidates and ballot measures in local elections!!! And no doubt America's traitors would be in favor of that too!!!

In Chicago illegal invaders can vote in school board elections and several municipalities in Maryland allow illegal criminals to vote in their municipal elections.

And no doubt the turncoat traitors who promote the further bastardization of America promote all of it!!!

Chuckest said...

I read the news story you linked. There are some aspects that I agree with, and some I find draconian.

You are wrong about me, I have always favored State control of immigration.

I know you are irrationally opposed to immigration. But the US benefits from so called illegal immigration. And we could benefit much more if we denied access to the welfare state to guest workers. If we reduced the cost of policing the borders, that would not need policing if we had a workable guest worker program.

But back to your news story, which opens with, “In a complaint and brief filed in the Northern District of Alabama, the department said that various provisions of H.B. 56 conflict with federal immigration law and undermine the federal government’s careful balance of immigration enforcement priorities and objectives. The brief filed today makes clear that, while the federal government values state assistance and cooperation with respect to immigration enforcement, a state cannot set its own immigration policy, much less pass laws that conflict with federal enforcement of the immigration laws.

That is just so much bullshit. The goal of the Federal Government is to eliminate the State boundaries, so any vestige of State nullification, or objection to the Feds goal would be non existent.

However, “the mandates that H.B. 56 imposes on Alabama law enforcement may also result in the harassment and detention of foreign visitors, legal immigrants and even U.S. citizens who may not be able to readily prove their lawful status.” In addition, …H.B. 56 imposes further burdens on children by demanding that students prove their lawful presence, which could discourage parents from enrolling their children in school. Someone should curtail these powers.

I promise you this if the Feds do not stop Alabama you will see a State suffer losses on a grand scale. That is what I seek by allowing Alabama and Arizona have their way with immigration.

Anonymous said...

Mr. McGlawn said:

"But the US benefits from so called illegal immigration"

No. You're wrong. The banks, the corporations and the politicians benefit from illegal immigration. The average citizen gets screwed.

"If we reduced the cost of policing the borders, that would not need policing if we had a workable guest worker program"

Stop the crap, Mr. McGlawn. We already have a work visa progam with well over a million foreigners who have paid their filled out their paperwork, paid their fees, taken their tests and are able and ready to come to the United States. Yet they are kept on hold indefintely while we spend $20B a year just in California to provide social services for illegal invaders. We punish the ones who follow the rules and reward the rule breakers. Anyone who supports such a policy in an anarchist.

“the mandates that H.B. 56 imposes on Alabama law enforcement may also result in the harassment and detention of foreign visitors, legal immigrants and even U.S. citizens who may not be able to readily prove their lawful status.”

All they have to do is show their damn papers. Every other civilized country requires it. If I visit europe I must carry my passport and the authorities have the right to ask for it if I come in contact with them. There is nothing wrong with requiring people to show their national I.D. It is done worldwide and it has a completely rational purpose.

"In addition, …H.B. 56 imposes further burdens on children by demanding that students prove their lawful presence, which could discourage parents from enrolling their children in school"

Screw 'em. If they and their kids aren't here lawfully I shouldn't have to pay to educate their kids. No other nation allows illegal foreigners to get free educations. It's people like you who support such nonsense who are bankrupting our country.

Mr. McGlawn said:

"I promise you this if the Feds do not stop Alabama you will see a State suffer losses on a grand scale"

Bullcrap. The crime committed by illegals and the huge deficits caused by taxpayer monies going to illegal invaders would evaporate. Plus, tens of thousands of jobs held by illegals would be open to unemployed US citizens. There is absolutely no basis behind what you say. It's only a wild assed guess that is totally wrong.

And again, Mr. McGlawn - you FAILED to address the HYPOCRISY of the Feds going after Alabama and Arizona and REFUSING to punish all the sanctuary cities that knowingly and willfully provide safe harbor to illegal invaders - in total defiance of US immigration laws.

The Feds only use the US Immigration Statutes against municipalities or states WHEN IT SERVES THEIR INHERENT PURPOSE - IN THE FURTHERANCE OF ALLOWING ILLEGAL INVADERS TO OVERRUN THE RIGHTS OF OUR US CITIZENS!!!

And anyone who supports illegal invaders usurping the rights of US citizens is IMO an anarchist.

Anonymous said...

"But the US benefits from so called illegal immigration"

Mr. McGlawn, if that were true Santa Ana and Los Angeles would be economically thriving communities and ideal cities in which to raise a family with superb standards of life.

But the opposite is true, isn't it, Mr. McGlawn?

In reality, Santa Ana and Los Angeles are both undeclared war zones where citizens are afraid to venture out at night and are on the verge of bankruptcy.

REAL LIFE is what you should research, Mr. McGlawn. Not nonsense academic papers written by men with agendas who live in ivory towers.

Please, Mr. McGlawn. Catch up with reality.

Anonymous said...

Another failure to respond by Mr. McGlawn.

He must be furiously working on another blog to avoid the questions and factual comments made in the recent posts by his opponent.

It is what it is.

Chuckest said...

You didn't like Real World examples when Newsweek names four border cities with the highest level of illegal immigrants and among the safest cities in the US. You pick two hell holes, that were hell holes for the last 20 years, and you want to blame it on illegal immigration.

Here are some additional real life that have a real source for the problems. Read: "Anti-illegal immigration bill stokes backlash in Alabama fields"

Sub title. Farmers in states like Alabama that have passed strong anti-illegal immigration laws are fighting back, saying they are losing labor and that US workers are unwilling to take up farm work.

By Mark Guarino, Staff writer / October 22, 2011
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/2011/1022/Anti-illegal-immigration-bill-stokes-backlash-in-Alabama-fields.

Read, "Alabam's Second Thoughts"
Alabama’s stance on its extremist immigration law is shifting from defiance to damage control. Gov. Robert Bentley admitted this month that the law needed fixing and promised that he and legislative leaders would do that in next year’s session. His retreat followed a letter from the state’s attorney general, Luther Strange, to legislative leaders suggesting that they throw out whole sections of the law to make it easier to defend in court.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/18/opinion/sunday/alabamas-second-thoughts.html?_r=1&ref=illegalimmigrants

Future ground rules. Personal insults will be edited out. Repeated messages will be edited out. I would still like to communicate by direct e-mail or even phone. When 74% of the people are wrong, that 74% takes in some very good people, you seem to be one of those people.

Anonymous said...

"You pick two hell holes, that were hell holes for the last 20 years, and you want to blame it on illegal immigration"

And illegal invaders have been pouring into both Santa Ana and Los Angeles for the last 20 years. It seems that everyone knows about it except for you. You seem to be a wealth of knowledge about everything except for all the FACTS that invalidate your viewpoints.

"Future ground rules. Personal insults will be edited out. Repeated messages will be edited out. I would still like to communicate by direct e-mail or even phone"

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year, Mr. McGlawn!!!!

Chuckest said...

Well A4, you had better stick with those isolated statistics. Lean more heavily on undocumented e-mail you get from the 74% who think Illegal immigration is a drag on the economy. Of course you will have to completely avoid the over 90% of advanced degreed economist that have literally studied the subject, that conclude illegal immigration is a NET GAIN to our economy. And I expect personal experience did not serve you well, when you named Santa Ana CA and Los Angeles CA, as being negatively affected by illegal immigration.
Here are the facts, that you claim to present. Forbes Magazine puts Santa Ana as the seventh Safest City in the US. From Forbes top ten safest cities 6 cities were from States that border Mexico.

From Area Vibes the top 20 Cities With the Lowest Crime in America, has Santa Ana as #9 and los Angles as way way down the list as #19 in the US. Not so bad for two cities that have illegal immigrants poring in. Area Vibes even list Montgomery AL as a very decent #24.

He are some other observations. Eleven cities in the top 20 are from States Bordering Mexico. A real surprising, over 10% of the cities in the top 61 are in Arizona, and 45% of the top 61 cities are located in States that Border Mexico.

Yea, A4 you better stick to those isolated statistics and undocumented e-mails.

Anonymous said...

Mr. McGlawn said:

" Forbes Magazine puts Santa Ana as the seventh Safest City in the US. From Forbes top ten safest cities 6 cities were from States that border Mexico.

From Area Vibes the top 20 Cities With the Lowest Crime in America, has Santa Ana as #9 and los Angles as way way down the list as #19 in the US. Not so bad for two cities that have illegal immigrants poring in. Area Vibes even list Montgomery AL as a very decent #24"

Do you believe any trash you read as long as it jives with your political or social agenda, Mr. McGlawn?

If you truly believe that Santa Ana is the 4th or 9th safest city in the United States you are IMO incredibly gullible with little ability for critical thought.

If you took a minute to think these hilarious claims through you would have realized that both Santa Ana and Anaheim (listed in the Area Vibes) are documented as being the TWO MOST crime infested cities in Orange County. IRVINE has been documented as being one of the most crime free and safest cities in Orange County. Yet IRVINE is not on the Forbes list or on the Area Vibes list, is it Mr. McGlawn? What does that tell you??? It should tell you that both lists are flawed in a big, big way. And there are MANY MORE cities as safe as IRVINE throughout the United States that are not on those manufactured lists either. You see, just because something is in print it doesn't mean it's correct or without prejudice, Mr. McGlawn. It takes critical thought to see through it. Don't believe everything you read, Mr. McGlawn. If it doesn't make any sense spit it out!!!

Enjoy your holidays!!!

Anonymous said...

Mr. McGlawn,

To show you how foolish the safest city lists you posted are, I invite you to look at the actual FBI data on violent crimes per city in the State of California for 2010:

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2010/crime-in-the-u.s.-2010/tables/table-8/10tbl08ca.xls

I looked at the data for Irvine, Anaheim and Santa Ana.

Irvine has a population of 217k. It had 120 violent crimes reported in 2010. That's 1 violent crime for every 1,808 citizens.

Anaheim has a population of 338,000. It had 1161 violent crimes in 2010. That's 1 violent crime for every 291 citizens.

Santa Ana has a population of 340,000. It had 1510 violent crimes in 2010. That's 1 violent crime for every 225 citizens.

Yet, with the actual FBI date showing that IRVINE is a MUCH SAFER city than Santa Ana or Anaheim - IRVINE is not even listed on the Area Vibe or Forbe's lists. :>)

That's an example of CRITICAL THINKING to uncover the TRUTH, Mr. McGlawn. You should try it sometime. :>)

And there are MANY, MANY more safer cities in California and the United States than Santa Ana or Anaheim. But none of them are listed on your source lists.

Another theory debunked.

Enjoy your holidays, Mr. McGlawn! :>)

Chuckest said...

Well. now that you tried to discredit my data on the "Ten Safest Cities" published by Forbes, a very unreliable publication. And Area Vibes, which I had never heard of before. With the FBI data on violent crimes.

Without saying that there are more aspects to "Safest Cities" Why don't you go ahead and tell us where Santa Ana and Los Angeles, where you say "illegal invaders have been pouring into...for the last 20 years" rank on the Violent Crime list. I think the readers want to know.

Anonymous said...

Mr. McGlawn said:

"Without saying that there are more aspects to "Safest Cities" Why don't you go ahead and tell us where Santa Ana and Los Angeles, where you say "illegal invaders have been pouring into...for the last 20 years" rank on the Violent Crime list. I think the readers want to know"

Before I answer your question - please respond to the question I asked you in the previous comment.

Since, according to the FBI data, Irvine has FAR FEWER VIOLENT CRIMES than Santa Ana or Anaheim - why isn't Irvine on the Forbes or Area Vibes safest cities lists???

And, as I mentioned, there are other cities in the US with comparable violent crime rates as Irvine. Why aren't they on the lists?

Please answer my question, Mr. McGlawn. If you ignore it or avoid it I will assume that you do not have a reasonable answer and agree that it is very strange that Irvine and other comparable cities were omitted from the lists - and raises very posssible flaws about how the lists were compiled.

Chuckest said...

Just as I suspected. Even the FBI Violent Crimes Report shows Santa Ana and Los Angeles ranking high. Come on A4 how did they rank? You know the numbers. They must not support your KNOW NOTHING agenda.

Anonymous said...

Mr. McGlawn said:

"Just as I suspected. Even the FBI Violent Crimes Report shows Santa Ana and Los Angeles ranking high. Come on A4 how did they rank? You know the numbers. They must not support your KNOW NOTHING agenda"

So fellow readers - pay close attention. First Mr. McGlawn posts a couple 'safest city' lists and supports the very dubious claim that Santa Ana is one of the top 10 safest cities in these United States (which is simply laughable for any of you Orange County residents). And when I point out the raw FBI data on violent crime by city to him and PROVE that there are MUCH SAFER CITIES omitted from his posted lists - HE FAILS TO RESPOND TO MY REBUTTAL - and instead changes his position by claiming that Santa Ana and Los Angeles rank "high" on the safest cities list - which any of you know is utter nonsense. How many of you would take a leisurely walk throughout the neighborhoods of Santa Ana or Los Angeles after dark?

Here, my friends. Go to the FBI violent crime stats yourself and go through the cities:

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2010/crime-in-the-u.s.-2010/tables/table-8/10tbl08ca.xls

You will see that Santa Ana had 28 murders in 2010. Few cities had so many murders. Note the only other cities with a murder rate so high: Bakersfield; Modesto; Compton; Inglewood; Riverside; Richmond; Oakland; Indio, etc... are known domicile cities for illegal invaders. Mr. McGlawn will not tell you this. But the facts are the facts.

Oh, btw, the data shows that Los Angeles had 3.84M residents and 21,484 VIOLENT crimes in year 2010. That is 1 VIOLENT crime for every 179 residents - a God awful ratio compared to most other cities. Santa Ana had a ratio of 1 violent crime for every 221 residents which ranks high (top third) on the most dangerous cities in California list.

Do the math, fellow readers. Don't pay attention to lists thrown at you by those with agendas. Take the data and compile your own lists. That will lead you to the FACTS and the TRUTH!!! :>)

Chuckest said...

A4 should be a Magician, because he is a master of miss direction. And why would he want to miss direct" It is because he has drank the Kool-Aid. Nothing anyone can say will alter his hatred for immigration. Please note, that he calls them INVADERS.

That attitude is understandable if one accepts the fiction that every immigrant that comes to the US for work takes an American’s job. That is just not the facts. Take two minutes and watch, Three Myths about Immigration at http://www.learnliberty.org/content/top-3-myths-about-immigration

Imagine my surprise when I Googled “Top Ten Safest Cities” and Forbes popped up listing Santa Ana the 7th safest city in heir list, and LA was tied for 8th with Anaheim

Forbes made their determination based on three criteria. Starting with a list of all American cities with a population above 250,000. Then they ranked each city on the number of violent crimes per 100,000 residents in 2009, as reported by the Federal Bureau of Investigation. Since the FBI only has data for cities that submit complete crime data, we were limited to looking at 71 places. Then they ranked each city on the number of traffic fatalities per 100,000 residents. We averaged the rankings for violent crime and fatal crashes in each city, to arrive at a final score.

A4 couldn’t have that. He had to discredit the Forbes results, so he went agoogling. He learned that Santa Ana was not #7 if you counted just VIOLENT CRIME. Ohhh, he reveled in that discovery.

We asked A4 the next logical question; Where did Los Angeles and Santa Ana fall on the FBI Violent Crime List. Well, as it turns out, Using just the FBI Violent Crime Stats Santa Ana ranks DROPS FROM the 7TH to 14th Safest City. And LA dropped from 8th to the 33rd Safest City. Not exactly what one would call hell holes.

Let me just repeat, A4 had better stick with those ISOLATED STATISTICS. Lean more heavily on UNDOCUMENTED E-MAILS from the 74% who WRONGLY think Illegal immigration is a drag on the economy. Of course you will have to ignore the over 90% of advanced degreed economist that have literally studied the subject that conclude illegal immigration is a NET GAIN to our economy. And I expect PERSONAL EXPERIENCE did not serve you well, when you named Santa Ana CA and Los Angeles CA, as being negatively affected by illegal immigration.

Anonymous said...

Mr. McGlawn said:

"Nothing anyone can say will alter his hatred for immigration. Please note, that he calls them INVADERS"

Another false accusation from Mr. McGlawn. I applaud LEGAL immigration. I detest ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION. And I made that clear from the start of these debates. Mr. McGlawn just prefers to distort the facts again. He seems to have an affinity for distorting the facts. Foreigners who enter our nation illegally are INVADERS. That is another fact that Mr. McGlawn chooses to ignore.

"That attitude is understandable if one accepts the fiction that every immigrant that comes to the US for work takes an American’s job"

Illegal invaders have literally destroyed the construction industry for American citizens, as well as the food service industry, the janitorial industry, the landscape industry and a good part of the manufacuring industry (factory jobs). In other words, they have stolen MILLIONS of jobs from American citizens.

"We asked A4 the next logical question; Where did Los Angeles and Santa Ana fall on the FBI Violent Crime List. Well, as it turns out, Using just the FBI Violent Crime Stats Santa Ana ranks DROPS FROM the 7TH to 14th Safest City. And LA dropped from 8th to the 33rd Safest City"

Bullshit. Santa Ana is the MOST DANGEROUS CITY IN ORANGE COUNTY. How could it possibly be the 14th safest city in the United States? SHOW US THE CALCULATIONS AND YOUR PROOF SOURCE - or your claims mean NOTHING - they are meaningless and absurd. Laughable! Next you will tell us that illegal invaders are intellectually superior and we should give them all free college educations!!! :>)

And once again Mr. McGlawn IGNORED that according to the FBI data that Santa Ana had 1 violent crime for every 221 residents and that Los Angeles has 1 violent crime for every 179 residents - VERY HIGH CRIME RATES BY ANY STANDARDS!

Again, readers.....scroll through the FBI crime data by city in CA that I linked for you. DO YOUR OWN CALCULATIONS. Determine the FACTS for yourself.

YOU WILL FIND THAT MOST OF THE VIOLENT CRIME IN CALIFORNIA IS CONCENTRATED IN THOSE CITIES THAT PANDER TO ILLEGAL INVADERS!!!!

Mr. McGlawn won't admit to that. He wants you to believe that illegal invaders come here to help you!!! HAH! In 2009 there were 102,375 illegal invaders in Calfornia jails. I guess they all came here to do work that you didn't want to do!!! HAH!